They tend to "Gunsmoke" them. That is shoot almost from the hip. They do well at the game we play but I fear things won't go so well if they lose the use of that device. I don't approve using a laser as a substitute for mastering the basics.

I bought a cheap one and mounted it on some .22's for S&G's. It's OK for a toy, in my opinion, not sure I'd put my butt on the line with it.

One place where they help is as a training tool. A new shooter gets instant feedback on sight alignment even without shooting.

particularly in low light conditions.

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Sincerely,

Hobie

...I consider a laser to be an important component, and Crimson Trace comes on automatically when you take your grip.

I have one on each of my XDM's (9 & 45)and do practice with them some in low light. They are useless in daylight. However, my serious practice is with the basics. The lasers are sighted in to the top of my front sight @ 21 ft so I can use them in low light if I have to.

Had one on my favourite J-frame but removed it 'cuz the state sez I can't pop grouse with a laser sighted resolver! Sold it to a friend who went through one of the well known shooting schools after an instructor stated they were useful in 'stress' situations. Unfortunately my Glock 36 won't accept a laser.
bob

A few years back after a USPSA or IDPA match (forget which now) a friend re-ran a few of the stages using the laser on his SIG. His times weren't a little slower, they were a LOT slower.

I've never seen the obsession with lasers sights? I look at them as a novelty. I've shot many guns with laser sights and they are neat but never saw the need to buy one. Lasermax is local to me so there was a time everyone and their brother had one on their Glock. Most of the local PD's had them years ago but I don't know of any using them now. I can shoot much faster with iron sight than looking for a laser dot. Probably from all the years of shooting iron sights.

That being said I know a lot of pros and instructors from shooting schools swear by them but that probably has more to do with promotion of the products for monetary gain than actual usefulness. Is there any real documentation of lasers being used in a defensive situation? I bet in a defensive situation the shooter used the iron sights and didn't even think of the laser if you asked them after the incident.

I love the Crimson Trace commercials with Todd Jarrett shooting. I'm sure he's using the iron sights. The laser is right on target every time because he is a world class shooter and can shoot that fast and accurate with iron sights.

There is a few limited situations where they could be useful. Low light but shouldn't you have a flashlight so you are sure of your target? Shooting from behind cover? What's wrong with just staying behind the cover seems safe to me.

I don't need one. On a gun for shooting at people I know it will be close and I will draw, point and fire without any hesitation looking for a dot on the persons body. As I get older the connection between my eye and my trigger is slower, especially if I have to hunt for a red dot.

I never could figure out night sights. If I cant see the target what does it help if I can see the sights? If I can see the body I can point the gun his direction instinctively with both eyes open and adjust after the first few misses (theoretically that is). I only concentrate on the relationship of the front sight or in the dark the extension of my hand and the target.

Those Crimson Trace lasers are cool though and I can see how that red laser can be intimidating.

But lets say you are confronted with one or maybe two guys that you know are armed. You have a J frame smith in the ready state on your strong side. You are arguing with them for some reason. Maybe you jilted their sister and they mean to break your legs. You make up your mind you are not leaving their in an ambulance either dead or broken legs. While the argument is escalating your mind has to handle two different discussions. The one with those two about their sister and the one with yourself as to what your plan is as to how to kill each one of these guys when the conversation dries up and Hector tells Juan to "Hey Hermano, Go get the bat out of the 63 Chevy Belair". Then you have to fight self-doubt. You think of the 158 grain lead round nose bullets in your chief special and how experts say they ain't worth a damn. You start wondering how much trouble your going to get into even if this is a justified shooting. You wonder if you can live with killing your ex future brother-in-laws. You think of Mossad Ayoob and "In the Gravest Extreme". Heck they only want to break my legs. If it doesn't hurt too bad?

Juan comes back with the bat. They have set themselves up for failure. Jaun has the bat in his right hand and his 38 Super is in his belt on the left side. Your plan is then to draw your Smith and drive a 158 grain lead round nose bullet directly into Hectors chest at about 3 feet distance. Of course by the time Juan drops the bat, hot lead is piercing his chest.

Then all of a sudden you wake up on the couch and Hector says. "Hey bro you were having a nightmare". "You kept pointing your hand and wiggling your finger like you was shooting a gun LOL". "Have another piece of Mama's Mexican pizza LOL". Juan went after some more beer." "Our sister and her friends will be back from the bridal shower soon so we better clean this place up."

Isn't it a good feeling to wake up from a nightmare?

Bob

Like night sights I once thought that every handgun should have them.

If one accepts the fact that almost all man on man shootings outside a military environment take place at very close range and speed is of the essence, things change a lot.

It only took a couple of force on force close range gun slinger classes to convince me that both night sights and lasers are of little value in a shootout at conversational distance (which is where they happen). Most shooters using lasers in these classes took them off their sidearms before the day was over.

One is much better served by buying a high quality airsoft gun that matches his sidearm and a good flashlight and shooting up his buddies in the backyard at night. You very quickly learn what works and what doesn't. Lasers are a disadvantage in these dynamic situations in that they take your attention away from your man and draw attention to yourself.

With a bit of practice almost everyone can reach a level of skill at point shooting that they can hit a door knob almost every time within 10'. This is plenty good.

That said, the Marines tell me that pointing a bunch of rifles fitted with lasers at rowdy ragheads will cause them to settle right on down very quickly...

Byron

I have a CT on my Smith 442. 99% of my practice is in the daylight hours where I can barely see the dot. If I am involved in a shooting, it will most likely be low light, where I see a laser as beneficial and it will be highly visible. I can see the usefulness of them, but wouldn't reccomend anyone rely solely on them for defensive use. I never understood the 'intimidation factor' of a laser. If I were a bad guy, advancing on a soon to be victim, I seriously doubt I'd be spending much time looking at my own chest or belly for a small red dot on there. The CT'a are bright and if you could zap someone in the eye, it would distract them, but if you pull a defensive sidearm, it had better be pointed a center mass!!

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